Forest Claudette on “Jupiter & Stone Between”
Growing up with classically trained musicians as parents. Early influences including Black Eyed Peas & alternative R&B. New music with overarching themes of gender queerness and figuring out how to best express that, as well as capturing what it feels like to question love and to discover different types of love. Feeling emboldened to use music to be more honest/vulnerable, and more.
Fuzzer: Where abouts are you at the moment?
Forest: I am in LA, I'm at Highland Park right now.
Fuzzer: So good! Thanks so much for taking the time to chat. First off, I’d love to know how you got started in singing, making your own music, and writing songs?
Forest: Yeah, of course. So I feel like I've been singing forever. My mom has a beautiful voice, and music has kind of always been around the house. Both my parents are classically trained musicians so I grew up playing violin which was not really optional (laughs). Mom teaches now - she taught me from when I was three to when I was twelve, but maybe I was a little bit older.
And then in high school, I really wanted to learn guitar, because I just had that bug, that itch to make stuff. And my brother from Northeast Party House, Zach - that had just started, just the very beginnings of that. And I was looking at them like “ooh, what's going on here?”. So I think that really planted the seed of contemporary music being a viable course of action, and so he fought for me to be able to learn guitar. He wasn't allowed (laughs). And I had this Swedish guitar teacher - he was an old rock head but he told me the fundamentals and it just gave me access to songwriting because writing on violin is very difficult (laughs). Just infinite trash scribbles in journals and whatever, worksheets at school until I think I was like 15 when I finished writing my first actual structured song. It was an incredible feeling - I still remember how it felt. It was just like the unlocking of a key. Well, I guess you don't unlock keys, but you know what I mean (laughs).
And my parents, obviously musicians, were always very supportive and encouraged me. I think that being very drawn to lyrics helped people buy in at an early point of being like “oh, maybe it’s not typical” just because I feel like everyone's focusing more on beats and guitarists or something like that. Since I can remember, I just have cared more about what people are saying than necessarily how they're saying anything. That's really been my access to storytelling. I remember in the beginning, in early high school, I was obsessed with Josh Pyke just because I always felt like he was telling the most interesting stories from the most interesting perspectives, and everything he said was just drenched in metaphors and similes - just everything that I loved about songwriting. Yeah I feel that's where I started!
Fuzzer: Incredible! And do you remember the first song that you wrote?
Forest: No, god no, thank goodness. I bet it's absolute garbage (laughs)
Fuzzer: (laughs) I bet it was amazing! You mentioned you had a classical upbringing - what were some of your main musical and creative influences growing up more in the songwriting space?
Forest: Yeah I mean, it’s interesting because I feel like half of what I remember are things that I've made up in a way, and then the other half, I definitely remember. All my family played basketball. My brother had a basketball tournament, he’s seven years older than me, and so I was quite young still. I was maybe eight or nine. And we had our Tarago at the time, our old van. Mum and Dad were driving a bunch of the kids to different games. It was all over the place. And as soon as you go back into the car, everyone was just cranking the new Black Eyed Peas. The Elephunk album and my mum was like “don’t listen!” to like “Hey Mama” and all this stuff. But some of those are really formative memories and that music was infectious, and I still love it. That album is near and dear to my heart.
So there’s that. There's a lot of pop - So Fresh CDs, Taio Cruz, Jason Derulo, all those cats, and then a bunch of indie stuff. Because my brother went to Germany and came back with all of these kind of more obscure indie influences. I feel like once he got back, he was listening to a lot more Two Door Cinema Club and Phoenix and all these guys. I mean, they were kind of taking over Australia at the time, and everywhere. And somewhere along that journey, I fell in love with Kings of Leon before I really discovered my own sense of the R&B world because my oldest brother, hip-hop head - only listening to rap, and I wasn't allowed to listen to that because there were too many n words (laughs) and just profanity I guess in general and my mum was like “nope!”. My access point was whatever was on Rage or whatever triple J was spinning or commercial radio. I remember watching Guy Sebastian win straight out of my house, and it was a big deal. We were all like “let's go!!” (laughs). I think we probably called in to vote at least once. So there was always a big melting pot of music.
And then I would say as I got older, like into high school, “Watch the Throne” album with Kanye and Jay-Z, and then Frank Ocean's feature on that. And it was like, you know when you drop a stone in a pond that's still and the ripples? It was sort of that effect. And then he just started popping up everywhere, and it was this new avenue to consume R&B and to express it. I feel like that sort of shifted my focus and attention and obsession in a way of like what is possible. And then, you know, obviously “Channel Orange”, and that I guess was just another door swinging open moment. I remember Frank Ocean, Solange, Anderson .Paak, Blood Orange, Lianne La Havas, Kelsey Lu - like all of these alternative R&B adjacent hip-hop rap. Just like this new wave of black music - it was just incredible, I got totally sucked in. And then it was Brittany Howard and Alabama Shakes and Little Simz. It's just growing all the time. I mean, I still love all that stuff. I listen to Phoenix's first album every now and again. Absolute bangers. But I think there was a lot of back and forth on what kind of music I wanted to do. Because when I was like 15/16, once I wrote that song I was like “I can do this. I'm going to do this. This is absolutely what I'm going to do. If it feels like this, it has to happen”. And so that became the focus, but I wanted to be able to make all the different kinds of music that I had heard and that I loved growing up, which was everything ever (laughs).
So once I came into high school, I was like “oh, I'm gonna just casually win triple J Unearthed High and then that will be my launch into the music industry”. And having conversations with my brother about “what kind of music do you want to make? What is your project? What do you want to speak to? Who do you want to emulate?”. All these things and I was like “whoaa!”. And to this point, I hadn't learnt any jazz chords yet. My teacher, beautiful guy, but he kind of left me dry and dry, right? It's like power chords to everything my guy (laughs). And so I remember once I started learning songs, because I think I started busking or something at some point, because my parents were like “do something, practice somehow”. And I learned Moses Sumney’s song “Plastic” and all of a sudden I felt like I’d unlocked all these chords. I was “oohhh, this is how you participate. That's where these vocal melodies are shaped from, like these chords give you those avenues, those sevens, those ninths, those thirteenths”, all that stuff. So that all that started to congeal - I was still really all over the place but I needed a type of alternative R&B that had to be a part of whatever I was doing.
Fuzzer: Yeah, absolutely! Those are some great references. And I think as you mentioned with the chords, it's all about learning the tools and once you've got those in your toolkit, then you can go and explore and realize things that you can do with your artist project that you couldn't do beforehand.
Forest: Exactly, even like learning how to refold what I learned to begin with in. It took me so long to feel comfortable just playing a straight major chord again. I hated it. I was just like “ugh, I spent six years just playing fucking major chords. I'm out”. It's so funny to think back to because I felt so limited and then all of a sudden I felt so free.
Fuzzer: Yeah exactly. That's a great way to put it. And congrats on the release of, I guess you’re kind of calling it the deluxe version, “Jupiter & Stone Between”! Combining those two EPs. It's so amazing, such a incredible project. What were the main themes that you wanted to delve into lyrically when you were writing this?
Forest: Yeah so obviously with “Jupiter”, with the overarching theme being gender queerness and trying to figure out how to express that, my ambition was to just find a way of talking about that stuff that wasn't, not that I didn't want it to be obvious, but I did want it to feel like the music that I love. And everything that I love is, I guess. What we were talking about before like metaphors, similes - everything to make it more magical and to have these comparisons that are larger than life. Having Jupiter as like a touchstone, as a place, the destination, really cracked that open. And I was like “oh, all of this represents all of this. When I talk about this, I'm talking about this.” I think that will always be important to me, because I love honesty in music, in storytelling and songwriting, and I think that's something that I'll never really grow out of. That’s just how I exist and how I consume and what I've grown up on. Because everything ever has already been said (laughs). You know what I mean? To an extent. So finding ways to say things that are just from my perspective or just different for the sake of being authentic and not just taking what has been laid out, if that makes sense.
Fuzzer: Yeah absolutely.
Forest: And then with “& Stone Between”, just love. Just wanting to capture what it feels like to question love, to discover different types of love. Obviously like “Moonlight”, talking about queerness in this context of sexuality, took me a really long time to feel comfortable to talk about what was the truth. And then to find the ways in which I could express that authentically. It's funny. I had a friend recently tell me that someone, that they're not dating anymore but were, a very flamboyant, queer, beautiful person, was like “Huh? What’s their go?”. And it was just like a really beautiful moment for me, because that was something that I feared so much putting these songs out was to have people question my validity and my authenticity and what I create. I feel like in approaching things the way that I have, there's not a lot of room for me to feel scared or bad about what people think, because I know that it's true. In that song, although it's super expressive, I'm obviously talking about different interactions with, I guess I'll say, folks assigned male birth. All I ever say is that I've been thinking about that film. I've just been thinking about Moonlight. I've been having ideas. I've been questioning things. I've felt uncomfortable, but now I feel more confident. Those are the things that I know are true or experiences that I had that didn't work out the way I wanted them to. Not being ready. It's not explicit, but it's detailed and that's something that I really, really love. And then something like “2AM”, that's just autobiographical. That's just everything that happened (laughs).
Fuzzer: LOVE that track, it’s so good.
Forest: Thank you. It always comes back to truth for me, but finding ways to articulate that is just mine.
Fuzzer: It's such a powerful message. And like you said, you shouldn't have to feel scared to express your emotions in that sense. And what's your usual writing and production process? What was it like for this project?
Forest: Oh, it definitely varies. So always when I'm writing, I especially with new people but even if it's someone I've worked with a bunch, I've done my best to collate a folder in my voice notes of just different ideas that I think would be interesting that I haven't fleshed out. But between you and me, I'm not gonna because I can't be bothered. I don't have the patience to sit down and just tinker with stuff. It kills me (laughs). I'm just like “fuck”. So I go through it, I'm like “these are all cool”. And then I get into a session and I'm like “hey, I have all these ideas - do you wanna listen through and if something piques your interest, we can start there”. So that's something that I've been doing for the past couple of years. But then things are always liable to change. Sometimes I get into the studio, I pick up an instrument, I'll play two things, and then we'll both be like “we should start here”. So it definitely changes. But this was the first time that I was like “these are the themes that I want to write to. This is the energy. This is what’s missing. This is what I want to try and articulate”. And it was way harder (laughs), especially within the time constraints that we had trying to find the through lines and the themes and veering off and being like “no, that's too far, it needs to be this” and then also allowing that. There are still songs I wrote from that period that have nothing to do with “Jupiter”, and I had to learn that not every song I'm going to write is going to be for this project, and I can't scrap everything,
The process was really all over the place. There were definitely some recurring people. Chris Hartz being one who produced and wrote “Moonlight” with me, and also Gabe Reali is on that track. He's a writer who I wrote “Two Years”. Love him to pieces - just a really talented writer, very thoughtful person. Gabe is really interesting because his energy, everyone would just assume that he's gay, but he's queer pan, whatever you want to call it. And so being able to write “Moonlight” with him is really special. It's like you understand what it means to exist in between whatever these quite hard and fast rules are. So I really appreciated that.
And then Alex Tirheimer, we wrote “Congratulations” and “Big Wigs” and “Kobe Beef”. He's kind of scattered all over the place. This is the first time I had my parents on, on strings, which was so special and a little box to tick of being like “cool, have cemented that into life”. So those are some of the things that are really special for me about making this project. But I made it here in the US, I made it back home, just everywhere. And in New Zealand with Rory Noble! He’s a gun, he's so talented. We wrote “Press On Me” - we wrote it in a day. Done.
Fuzzer: Fast stuff! That’s so awesome, I love it. And one thing we're doing for each of our interviews is we're going to customize a cocktail recipe in regards to the project we're talking about. So if Jupiter & Stone Between was a cocktail, what do you think it would be?
Forest: Amazing. Okay, so I think like, weird place to start but charcoal for like the kind of spacedust. I don't know much about alcohol, but I'm gonna say gin because it's quite introspective. You could get a bit sad, but it's okay. Lime juice for the good old days of “Everything Was Green” (laughs). And I want carbonated cranberry juice and I can't really tell you why except for the colour, I want that deep kind of red.
Fuzzer: Okay, I think we can definitely work with that. So we've got a bit of cranberry, some lime, some charcoal. I think that's a good combination of flavours honestly, I feel like that would mix well together with the gin.
Forest: Oh, god, that's stressful. Anyone could swap out whichever spirit of their choice. I'm not committed because half my brain's like .. tequila? I think all of that with tequila might be better.
Fuzzer: Yeah, tequila can be a bit chaotic but I love tequila.
Forest: I mean, the chaos - I think that should be a part of it then. It's tequila. Fuck the gin. It's tequila (laughs)
Fuzzer: (laughs) Yeah I like that, great answer! And what do you think one of the biggest lessons that you've learned in your career so far has been so far or has there been any pieces of advice that you've been given, that you've that you've held onto?
Forest: Couple things. I feel like from this project specifically, I feel emboldened to use music more to talk about the things that I'm unsettled with still in my life. I feel somehow more emboldened to be more honest and to kind of tap into all the things that I feel insecure about. Whatever plagues me really, cuz I just think that there's so much value in sharing those experiences when you are in a position like I am, to make everything look quite glorious. I think it's important for people to know that life is still rich with difficulty, as well as all the things that are cool and exciting.
For like performing, a friend of mine's father passed away maybe a year and a half ago now, and before he did, I was just about to go on my first leg of tours, and he was telling me how to combat nervousness or stage fright or anything like that. I guess the anxiety that comes up before you get on, like worrying whether or not it's going to be a good show. And he talked about the two way nature of music and performing. Yes, it looks like everything's about you, and everyone's focused on you. And what you're going to do, and if your performance is good, if you’re gonna hit this note or hit that note. But everyone is also there for you in the way of, you give something and everyone gives you something back, and everyone wants you to succeed. Also, performing to anyone that connects with what you have to say is, I'd say probably one of the most special things - definitely one of the most special experiences that I've had. So combating those feelings of gratitude and always remembering that it's just a privilege to be doing what I'm doing helps me level down a bit. I mean, I get pretty anxious before shows, but it does help (laughs). So I always try to hold on to that.
Fuzzer: I love that and I can only imagine for anyone, and naturally, it can be so scary performing. But I agree that doing it with the intention of being able to connect, and help people which you may be doing unknowingly and positively affecting their life in some way, must feel really fulfilling. And what kind of music are you listening to at the moment? Do you have any new songs or new artists that you've found that you'd recommend we listen to?
Forest: Okay so I'm actually pretty bad for this, not gonna lie. I get trapped in the people that I love, and then they’re always putting out new stuff. But I'm super excited for Michael Kiwanuka’s album. I cannot wait for that. His first single “Floating Parade” - oh, genuinely I think that might be in my top listens this year. I’m always listening to Brittany Howard in some capacity - I've listened to “To Be Still” a lot this year. Super excited for Orion's Sun's new album. But those two albums I’m very excited for. There’s this artist Helado Negro - hispanic artist who I love, he makes some of the most beautiful music ever and his album “This Is How You Smile” is just something that I always come back to. It’s just so, so peaceful - so warm and cosy and holds you and is just nostalgic and it’s sweet and it’s playful.
Fuzzer: Amazing, that’s so good! That’s such a great list so I’m gonna have to do a lot of listening now. And last question for you - you’re heading out on a UK/Europe tour! What are you looking forward to most about those performances?
Forest: Yeah, coming in fast! I’m excited to just be travelling again. Europe was just so kind to me when I was there earlier this year. You never know what’s gonna happen, you never know what the world will bring into your orbit, but I’m just excited to see more of the world and be able to perform. It’s still hard to process that places I’ve never been have people that listen to my music to the degree that they would want to come out and see it. I just think that’s so special and I don’t want it to be lost on me. That’s got to be the most exciting part. However, it’s going to be quite cold so I’ll see how I go (laughs).
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